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A Base Ochlocracy


Davis, Henry 1854. General Introduction. In: The Works of Plato. A new and literal version, chiefly from the text of stallbaum. Vol. II: Containing The Republic, Timæus and Critias.. By Henry Davis. London: Henry G. Bohn, i-xxvii. [Internet Archive]

Almost contemporaneously among the learned of Europe, there has arisen a tendency to study the sublime, spiritual philosophy of Plato, in prefernece to the cold materialism of Aristotle, on which have been erected so many of the systems that have risen and had their day in our literary world. That this has not hithero been the case, and that Platonism (which, in its spiritualising and purifying tendency, may be deemed to approach Christianity,) has not hithero been exalted to its true dignity and station in metaphysical history, is chiefly attributable to the absurd mysticism and fanatical extravagances which the New Platonists introduced in their interpretations, and which have too frequently been regarded as true expositions of the great philosopher, by modern writers either too lazy or too ignorant to go and drink the clear waters at the fountain-head. (Davis 1854: i)

Plato is spiritual, Aristotle is dry, the neoplatonists (Plotinus, Proclus, etc.) are incomprehensible.

His youth falls in the tim eof the Peloponnesian war; and his whole life is closely connected with that brilliant period when the literature of Attica, historical, dramatic, and rhetorical, was at the zenith of its glory, - at a time, however, (we must add,) when the seeds of Athenian decay were being rapidly brought to maturity by the substitution of a base and brutalizing ochlocracy for the rational government of good and patriotic men, - and by the elevation of a troop of superficial, seductive, truth-perverting, applause-loving sophists to the throne of true, noble, elevating, divine philosophy. (Davis 1854: ii)

Define:ochlocracy - "government by the populace; mob rule."

He visited Megara, Cyrene, the Greek cities in Magna Græcia and Sicily, (where he became acquainted wit hArchytas, Philolaus, and others of the Pythagorean school;) and he travelled even as far as Egypt, where he stayed thirteen years in gaining an insight into the mysterious doctrines and priest-lore of the sacredotal caste. (Davis 1854: iii)

Curious to find out which "others" aside from Archytas, Philolaus and Dion.

Whatever may have been their intentions, however, they were all frustrated by the weak and luxurious character of Dionysius, who, however he might relish for a time the sage and virtuous lessons of Plato, soon found it more conformable to his personal interests to follow the counsels of Philiston, his father's friend and adviser. Dion thereupon became the object of his nephew's jealousy, and was banished on the ground of his ambitious designs. (Davis 1854: iv)

You philistenes! Oh, I mean, Philiston.

But, howevere essentially different the form of the dialogues adopted by Plato from that pursued by other writers, they were composed, as respects their matter, with constant refyerence to the labours of his predecessors. In fact, his whole system is rather critical and eclectic than dogmatical; and several of his dialogues assume the form of criticisms on the notions of former philosophers, rather than the formal developments of any doctrines of his own. He was thoroughly conversant not only with the leading principles and peculiar system of Socrates, but had no mean acquaintance, besides, with the notions of Pythagoras, Heracleitus, Parmenides, Empedocles, Zeno, Anaxagoras, and Protagoras, - extracts from whose writings, with animadversions on their opinions, are abundantly scattered throughout his works. (Davis 1854: vi)

A rundown of Plato's philosophical predecessors.

His entire system is based, in fact, on some grand and novel ideas, perhaps faintly shadowed forth by others, but never clearly unfolded till the time of Plato. The opposition between the general law and the particular facts, between the objects of reflection and the objects of the senses, between the world of intelligence and the visible world, was never clearly proclaimed till Plato announced it. Socrates, indeed, awakened the germ of science, and laid the foundation of dialectics; but it was Plato who gave system and consistency to the whole. (Davis 1854: vi)

A claim I have not seen before. Perhaps it's too obvious for many to mention.

The most obvious arrangement is according to their chronological order; - and viewing them in this light, we may divide them into three classes. In the first are those written by Plato before he set out on his travels, - namely, the Lysis, Phædrus, Laches, Hippias major, Protagoras, Charmides, Ion, Menon, Alcibiades i., Euthydemus, Euthyphron, Crito, and the Apology of Socrates; - in the second are those which he drew up on his return from his travels, and before his second journey to Sicily, - namely, the Gorgias, Theætetus, Sophistes, Politicus, Cratylus, Parmenides, the Symposium, Menexenus, Philebus, and Phædo; and in the Third we place those written in more advanced life, when his views had become matured, and his doctrines thoroughly digested into one harmonious system, - namely, that noble trilogy comprising the Timæus, Critias, and Republic, - to which ma ybe added the long dialogue of the Laws, which, though perfectly genuine, is but loosely connected with the general system of PLato's philosophy, and seems to be quite an extraneous section of this part of his writings. (Davis 1854: vii)

Recording this for sake of comparison, because the order is sure to be improved before the end of that century, even.

We have particularised here only those Dialogues which are usually regarded as genuine. The Hipparchus, Minos, Alcibiades ii, Clitophon, Theages, Eryxias, Demodocus, Epinomis, and the Letters, are of disputable origin, and to be assigned, probably, to some of Plato's followers. (Davis 1854: vii, fn)

The list is growing (cf. Taylor 1804: cv, fn 1).

"It would be proved, if by nothing else, by one little touch in the Republic. The Republic is the summary of his whole system, and the key-stones of all the other Dialogues are uniformly let into it. But the object of the Republic is to exhibit the misery of man let loose from law, and to throw out a general plan for making him subject to law, and thus to perfect his nature. This is exhibited on a large scale in the person of a State; [...]" (Sewell; in Davis 1854: viii)

Is that what the Republic is about? How laws can perfect the nature of man?

With Plato, however, as with Socrates, the awakening of doubt was not [|] merely a vain display of logical skill and clever cavilling, but had for its object the removal of the unstable ground on which opinions may have been rested, and the formation of more settled convictions: - indeed, it was exalted by him into a regular discipline of the mind set in operation for the single purpose of investigating the truth. (Davis 1854: ix-x)

Define:cavilling - "make petty or unnecessary objections."

God, then, is the good itself, of which this sensible world is only an image. But in the present world it ought to be man's endeavour to enlarge and cultivate his science, in order that, by attaining to as pure a knowledge as possible of the multiplicity of ideas, he may be able to discern therein, however imperfectly, the unity of truth and science which subsists in the good. (Davis 1854: xv)

The world is an image of god.

Of Plato's moral doctrines, the most important are the following: - that, independently of other ends, virtue is to be pursued as the true good of thes oul, the proper perfection of man's nature, the power by which the soul fitly accomplishes its existence, whereas vice is a disease of the mind (Republ. iv. 444. c.), arising from delusion or imperfect apprehension of our proper interests; - that the real freedom of a rational being consists in an ability to regulate his conduct by reason, and that every one not guided by his reason, encourages insubordination in the mental faculties, and becomes the slave of caprice or passion; (πολλῆς μὲν δουλείας τε κ, ἀνελευθερίας γέμει ἡ ψυχὴ αὐτοῦ. Republ. ix. 577. d.) - that virtuous conduct, apart from its benefits to society, is advantageous to the individual practising it, inasmuch as it ensures that regularity of the imagination, - that tranquility and internal harmony, which constitutes the mind's proper happiness. (Davis 1854: xvii)

What in the world does virtuous conduct have to do with the regularity of the imagination? And what of the opposite: does vice lead to irregular imagination?

The Republic of Plato is a development of the analogy between the ideas of the perfect man and the perfect State, - the two principles being elaborated throughout the Dialogue, in perfect harmony and mutual dependence on each other. (Davis 1854: xix)

What dependence? If I compare two things, does that comparison establish a dependence between those two things?

Commencing with the consideration of Virtue, (which consists in the harmonious cultivation of the different intellectual and moral faculties,) he opens the inquiry with a kind of analysis or the human mind, which he divides into three parts, - first, the rational or reasoning principle, (τὸ λογιστικὸν), - secondly, the spirit or will, (τὸ θυμικὸν or θυμοειδὲς), - and thirdly, the appetite or passion (τὸ ἐπιθυμητικὸν), - which last, however, indicates nothing beyond that vital impulse which leads from one sensation to another. (Davis 1854: xx)

The parts of soul. This is the first I've seen someone insert "will" into secodness.

Furthermore, - from the exercise and combination of these three faculties there are generated four principal or cardinal virtues: - 1. Prudence or Wisdom (ϕρονήσις); - 2. Courage or Fortitude (ἀνδρεία), by which Plato means the maintenance of right opinion as to what is and is not to be feared, (περὶ τῶν δεινῶν,) i.e. as to good and evil; - 3. Temperance or Self-controul (σωϕροσύνη); - and 4. Justice (δικαιοσύνη), which, with Plato, does not simply mean the virtue of rendering to all their due, but stands for that harmonious and proportional development of the inner man, by means of which each faculty of his soul performs its own functions without interfering with the others. (Davis 1854: xxi)

The only thing odd about this is "Prudence", which I usually associate with secondness. Define:prudence - "the quality of being prudent; cautiousness."

These he classes under three heads or divisions, corresponding with the faculties of the soul, - viz., 1. the βουλευτικὸν, (counsellors) those who employ reason in the contemplation of what best suits the State, - 2. the ἐπικουρικὸν, - those who aid the βουλευταί with a ready will, - 3. the χρηματιστικὸν, who are bent on gain and selfish gratification. (Davis 1854: xiii)

Guards, auxiliaries and merchants. First time seeing them named in Greek. The auxiliaries represent epicureanism?

Whewell, William 1861. Preface. In: The Platonic Dialogues for English Readers. Vol. III: The Republic and The Timæus. Cambridge: MacMillan and Co, v-x. [Internet Archive]

When I published the first volume of my Platonic Dialogues for English Readers, it was done as an experiment to ascertain whether I was right in supposing that a large portion of the Platonic Dialogues could, by combining translation and comment, be made intelligible and even interesting to ordinary readers of English literature. The reception which that publication met with was such as to encourage me to publish other Dialogues of which I had already, for my own gratification, made translations in the same manner; and even to go on to translate some additional Dialogues, for the purpose of continuing the series. (Whewell 1861: v)

Translating Plato for fun.

The Republic contains, especially, a theory respecting the foundations of morality which, if true, supplies an answer to many of the questions discussed in the previous Classes of Dialogues. In those previous Classes, Plato was in search of ethical definitions and ethical truths: in the Republic, he conceives himself to have found such definitions and such truths. (Whewell 1861: vi)

The Republic stands out as a dialogue in which Plato puts forward a theory of his own, rather than merely criticizing those of others.

The Republic, being thus mainly didactic, loses one of the principal charms of the previous Dialogues, the lively drama of conversational debate: except in the First Book of the Republic, the Thrasymachus, which is really a Dialogue of the Anti-sophist class. (Whewell 1861: vii)

Book I is as though a separate dialogue titled Thrasymachus after its most memorable character.

[...] add to this, subtle speculations concerning the soul and its faculties, anticipating the most acute analyses of modern psychologists: - and we have, I think, matter in which the English reader may find grounds for an admiration of Plato, and a pleasure in reading him, not altogether disproportionate to the reputation which belongs to his name. (Whewell 1861: viii)

I'm basically here because 19th century philosophical psychology is rooted in Plato's tripartite theory of the soul.

Whewell, William 1861. Introduction to the Republic. In: The Platonic Dialogues for English Readers. Vol. III: The Republic and The Timæus. Cambridge: MacMillan and Co, 3-5. [Internet Archive]

The title of this Dialogue might be more properly rendered The Polity: since, as M. Cousin observes, it does not describe or single out any particular kind of constitution, such as the term Republic indicates. This Polity is no more a Republic than a Monarchy or an Aristocracy; and PLato repeatedly calls it by both these names. (Whewell 1861: 3)

Similar issue in Estonian: it is recommended we not even use Riik ("State") over Vabariik ("Republic", literally 'free state') but just call it Politeia after the Greek original (cf. Lepajõe 2022: 15-16).

The Second Part, which I have entitled Of the Ideal Polity and of Virtue, is really the cardinal and essential part of the work; describing, as I have already said, Plato's idea of a Perfect State, and illustrating, by means of that, the moral constitution of a virtuous man. And accordingly this Part ends (at the end of Book IV.) with a formal conclusion. But the Third Part, Of Bad Polities and of Vices, illustrates negatively what the second Part had illustrated positively, and ends (at the beginning of Book IX.) with a still more formal conclusion. (Whewell 1861: 4)

This structure can also be found in some "Synoptic Table[s] of Contents".

A Community of Parts


Sachs, David 1963. A Fallacy in Plato's Republic. The Philosophical Review 72(2): 141-158. DOI: 10.2307/2183101

Recent writers on the Republic tend to refrain from detailed discussion of the argument about justice and happiness, the main argument of th work. In the last decades there have been few assessments of Plato's conclusions about the relationship of justice and happiness, namely that just men are happier than any men who are unjust, and that the more unjust a man is, the more wretched he will be. Equally rare have been attempts to examine critically th eargument by which Plato reached those conclusions. In this paper I make such an attempt. (Sachs 1963: 141)

The road is much more interesting than the destination.

Certainly no doubt is cast upon one repeatedly implied claim, a claim taken for granted in the later books and presupposed by the over-all structure of the Republic: namely, that whether one should lead a just or unjust life is to be decided by determining which life is the happier. It is, however, indispensable for evaluating the main argument of the Republic to realize that this claim cannot be understood in the same way throughout; it cannot, because of the two conceptions of justice in the Republic. I will call the first the vulgar conception of justice, the second the Platonic conception. (Sachs 1963: 142)

Hence the hypothetical perfectly just and perfectly unjust persons.

As Plato states them in this passage, the vulgar criteria for justice consists in the nonperformance of acts of certain kinds; and, of course, injustice, according to the vulgar conception, consists in performing such acts. The passage shows that Plato supposes that the just man - as he conceives him - is less likely than anyone else to perform those acts, to embezzle, thieve, betray, behave sacrilegiously, fail to keep oaths or agreements, commit adultery, neglect his parents or the service he owes to the gods. Plato thinks the conduct of his just man, for from being at variance with the vulgar conception of justice, will exemplify it. (Sachs 1963: 143)

Just don't do things that are bad, mkay.

The classification appears to be roughly the following: goods valued for their own sake, goods valued for their [|] own sake and their effects, and goods valued only for their effects. The second type of goods is the one better in every way and Socrates says that, if a man is to be happy, he should thus regard justice; that is, value it both for its own sake and for its effects. (Sachs 1963: 144-145)

Effects/consequences.

The difficulty to which it has given rise is this: on the one hand, Socrates states to Glaucon than justice is to be valued for its own sake as well as for its effects, and Glaucon and Adeimantus stress in their speeches that they want Socrates to praise justice in itself (358d 1-2; 363a 1-2; cf. 367c 5-d 5); on the other hand, throughout the Republic, Socrates confines himself to an attempt to show that being just eventuates in happiness and pleasure for the just man; that is, he praises justice solely for what he alleges are its effects. Consequently, it has been charged that Plato, at the start of Book II, misconceived the task he thereafter tried to carry out; that he promised to prove that justice is good both for its own sake and for its effects, but addressed himself only to what he presumed were its effects. (Sachs 1963: 145)

The footnote only now (1/3 in) gives an indication that this discussion had begun with Foster's paper "A Mistake of Plato's in the Republic" (1937).

"That is not the opinion of most people. [...] The yplace it in the troublesome class of good things, which must be pursued for the sake of the reward and the high place in public opinion which the ybring out which in themselves are irksome and to be avoided." Glaucon's words are clear; according to the many, he is saying, justice in itself, since it is harsh or painful, should be avoided. [...] Glaucon's classification of goods, then, proves quite complex: first, items which by themselves (or on their own) are productive of good and of nothing else; second, those which by themselves are productive of good and, in conjunction with other things, have additional good effects; third, those which by themselves have bad effects but also have good ones which outweigh them. (Sachs 1963: 147)

A valuable clarification. The third class is actually something like "bads" in themselves but goods by their consequences.

Plato's consideration of the matter, it should be observed, is developed in terms of his own conception of justice. Thus in Book IV, Socrates states that there is one form of ἀρετή, or excellence, of the soul but limitless ones of κακία, or defect (cf. 445c 5-d 1; also 449a 1-5), four of which are worth special notice; they [|] are the defects responsible for the timocratic, oligarchical, democratic, and tyrannical polities of the soul, the famous discussion of which occupies Books VIII and IX. (Sachs 1963: 150-151)

Reminiscent of what is called the Anna Karenina principle: "All happy families are alike; each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way."

Toward the end of Book IV, Socrates formulates the Platonic conception of the just man: a man, each part of whose soul attends to its business or function, performing no tasks but its own. Further, Socrates says that if an action preserves or helps to produce the condition of the soul in which each of its parts does its own task, one ought to believe the action just and name it so, and believe an action unjust and name it so if it has a contrary effect (see 443e 4-444a 2). In accord with this, Socrates suggests that acting justly is to be understood as acting in a way which will produce the condition of justice in the soul, and that acting unjustly is to be understood as behavior which produces a contrary condition. Glaucon, I take it, is sounding a like note when he affirms that just acts are necessarily productive of justice, unjust ones of injustice (444c 1-3; 444c 10-d 2). (Sachs 1963: 152)

This is easy enough to imagine macrocosmically: everyone tending to their own business. But what does this actually mean microcosmically? Is acting justly when he exercises moderation and eats only a little bit of cake, as a treat?

On Plato's view, the fulfillment of the functions of the soul's parts constitutes wisdom or intelligence, courage, and self-control; and if these obtain, justice, according to Plato, also obtains. Intelligence, courage, and self-control are, however, prima facie compatible with a variety of vulgar injustices and evil-doings. [|] Neither as usually understood nor as Plato characterizes them are those virtues inconsistent with performing any of the acts Thrasymachus and Glaucon mention as examples of injustice. In this regard it is tempting to assert that the most than can be said on behalf of Plato's argument is that crimes and evils could not be done by a Platonically just man in a foolish, unintelligent, cowardly, or uncontrolled way. (Sachs 1963: 154-155)

Doesn't Plato deal with this exact issue around 519a?

Demos, Raphael 1964. A Fallacy in Plato's Republic? The Philosophical Review 73(3): 395-398. DOI: 10.2307/2183665

Sachs makes a vital distinction which helps clear up a confusion in Plato's argument. Sachs insists that we must keep apart two questions: (a) Does justice entails happiness? (b) Does justice entail vulgar or conventional morality (φορτικὸς; Republic, 444e 3)? He rightly insists that an answer to the first questions has no bearing on the answer to the second. In other words, were we to succeed in proving that a just man will be happy, we should still not know that he will be conventionally moral. (Demos 1964: 395)

Justice could make one happy without it corresponding to the vulgar conception of justice?

A very important use of "justice" by Plato is the rendering to every man his due. This is the refrain running throughout Republic I; it is the ordinary, the conventional meaning of justice; it is the conception of justice as a social virtue. But in Book IV, Plato comes up with a different and unconventional definition of justice; it is, so far as I know, unique with Plato among Greek philosophers, and indeed Sachs calls it Platonic justice. This is the view of justice as (a) the state of the soul in which no part of the soul interferes with the functioning of the other parts - call it the principle of nonintervention - and (b) the state of the soul in which the various parts are working in mutual harmony and friendship (ὁμόνοια, φιλιά; 351d 3; 433e 2-4). Should anyone wonder whether there is any significant difference between [|] the two notions, let him reflect on this pair: desegregation and integration. (Demos 1964: 395-396)

A familiar distinction: "Justice is a principle of differentiation and specialization of the parts: Sophrosyne is a principle of agreement, harmony, unity." (Cornford 1912: 248)

Plato likens the soul to the city. In contrast to the outer city, the soul is an inner city; it is a community of parts - of reason, thumos, and innumerable appetites. Can he then be charged with changing, or even stretching, the meaning of the word, if by Platonic justice he means giving every part of the soul its due? The change, if change there be, would seem to be in the conception of the soul as a community, not in the conception of justice. And if my suggestion is correct, it should throw light on the lacuna, or what Sachs calls the fallacy of irrelevance. (Demos 1964: 396)

Not even attempting to translate thumos, the most suspect part. Saying outright that the soul is a city ignores the nature of the analogy. The soul is still only metaphorically a city.

In short, there seems to be a leap from the conception of justice as caring for one's own good to caring for other people's good. Plato asserts that justice is to the human soul what health is to the human body; but surely no living body aims at anything but its own health. Platonic justice is the proper ordering of one's own life; why then should a just man in this sense of justice care to bring about a proper ordering of other peolpe's lives? (Demos 1964: 397)

Unless, of course, you have working ultrahyperimmunity, that is, your immune system is so good that it doesn't just protect you but also has area of effect damage and heals anyone who comes near you. The addendum "working" is necessary because, as the documentary titled Unnatural Selection showed, sometimes it may cause rapid aging in those you come into contact with.

Foster, M. B. 1937. A Mistake of Plato's in the Republic. Mind 46(183): 386-393. DOI: 10.1093/mind/xlvi.183.386

I have not observed that any commentator has noticed that the book opens with a false statement of the point at issue. Glaucon begins by distinguishing 'good things' into three classes. There is (i) the good which "we should like to possess not through a desire of its consequences, but for its own sake, such as enjoyment, and pleasures which are harmless and which have no subsequent results other than enjoyment"; (ii) "that which we love both for its own sake and for the sake of its consequences, such as wisdom and sight and health"; (iii) goods of which "we should say that they are troublesome, but that they benefit us, and we should not wish to have them for their own sakes, but for the sake of the rewards and other things which result from them". Examples of this third class are "gymnastic exercises, submission to medical treatment, the practice of medicine or of any other money-making pursuit". It is then required of Socrates that we shall prove that justice belongs to the second of these classes, against his opponents, who would place it in the third. (Foster 1937: 386)

A pretty concise statement of the problem. The three types of good are probably going to be the kind of thing that I collect various expositions of, perhaps to construct a table from (some fine day). I should start tagging them "Glauconic goods" or something.

According to the views represented by Glaucon and Adimantus, the beneficial consequences usually ascribed to justice are in reality consequences, not of justice, but of seeming to be just. It wolud follow that The reputation of justice belongs to the third division of good things, but that justice itself belongs to none of the three. The examples which Glaucon quotes of his third class of goods make it amply clear that none of Socrates' opponents could have ranked justice among them. Thrasymachus would not have maintained of gymnastic exercises that it is something which no man would undergo unless compelled by superior force; nor would Adimantus have argued that the benefits commonly tatributed to medical treatment can be equally well attained by pretending to submit to the treatment. (Foster 1937: 387)

This raises a curious question: what else belongs to this third class? And if this goes for reputation of justice, are other reputations also in this third class? What would this analysis yield if applied on modern social media, where e.g. exercising at the gym is accompanied by constant visual updates of exercising at the gym - is this not a case where something like reputation for going to the gym becomes a good over and above the exercise itself?

It has now appeared that Socrates nowhere maintains that thesis, nor his opponents that antithesis; that both Socrates himself, and his interlocutors subsequently, assume that a different problem from this has been proposed; and that the speeches of Glaucon and Adimantus, if we ignore Glaucon's opening passage and a few subsequent references to the threefold division of goods, really do propose a different problem. Only one conclusion is possible. It is necessary to recognize that the threefold division of goods is irrelevant to the issue, and that Plato made a mistake in inserting the passage of Glaucon's speech in which it is contained. A true interpretation of Plato's meaning in the Republic requires us to dismiss what he says in that passage. (Foster 1937: 390)

It is almost as if the Glauconic goods were some extraneous bit of sophistry inserted into the discussion because it had the appearance of aiding the discussion along and needed to be tested out. That is, as if it might have been a piece of pythagoreanism, as Iamblichus' biography suggests.

Foster, M. B. 1938. A Mistake of Plato in the "Republic": A Rejoinder to Mr. Mabbot. Mind 47(186): 226-232. DOI: 10.1093/mind/xlvii.186.226

This is obvious, and of course Mr. Mabbott does not deny it. He defends Plato against the charge of inconsistency by maintaining that the third division of goods was never intended by Plato to represent the class in which justice was placed by the opponents of Socrates, but only that in which it was placed by οἱ πολλοί. [...] When I read this passage, I can only rub my eyes and recur to the text of the Republic. (Foster 1938: 227)

What a minute thing to quibble over.

I should not dream of committing the solecism of calling Plato's doctrine Utilitarian, and I can applaud the arguments which Mr. [|] Mabbott directs against that error, because it is not my feathers that are made to fly. (Foster 1938: 227-228)

Define:solecism - "a grammatical mistake in speech or writing." "a breach of good manners; an instance of incorrect behaviour." Greek: speaking incorrectly. As to the idiomatic expression "it is not my feathers that are made to fly", ChatGPT explains that it "means that the speaker believes they are not suited or equipped for a particular task or situation. The phrase is often used to express humility and self-awareness, acknowledging one's limitations and admitting that they cannot do everything."

Plato's doctrine is not Utilitarian, but neither is it Kantian. Though we have only to see what justice really is in order to see that it is worth while being just, that is because the insight into the nature of justice makes it immediately evident that happiness is its necessary consequence; it is not because an insight into the nature of justice makes it clear that justice would be worth having whether it resulted in happiness or not. (Foster 1938: 228)

Instead, platonism is utilitarian kantianism, right?

What evidence does he produce for this conclusion? In the whole course of his article he cites only one passage which supports it; that is the passage of the Republic in which the duty is imposed upon the philosophers of "returning to the cave" on the ground that justice demands it, in spite of the fact that this will entail a diminution of their happiness. I admit this single passage, but as I have already devoted an article to the attempt to show that its implicatinos are inconsistent with all the rest of the moral philosophy of the Republic, I may perhaps be excused from dealing further with it now. (Foster 1938: 230)

This is another one of those things that completely missed me when I read the book, but which J.O. picked up immediately. What to make of it, I still do not know. (It is likely that I'll be dealing with the Republic for a while, so I expect this to turn up again sooner or later.)

On the other hand, I think that Mr. Mabbott's account of the relation in which the argument of these books stands to that of Book IX is as erroneous as mine was previously. He says: "I believe that Book IX could have disappeared [...] without shaking the central edifice of the ethical position at all". "As soon as it is clear that justice is the state of thes oul described in Book IV, the battle is over. [...] Why then raise the question in Book IX? Because our ideas of the justice of the Universe would be shaken if justice and pain were necessarily connected."
This is not the true answer to the question which Mr. Mabbott asks. The battle is not over at the end of Book IV, because it is not sufficient for Socrates to prove that the just man is happy. He has to prove also that the unjust man is unhappy, or less happy; for the proof of the happiness of the just would not be a reason for preferring justice if it could be supposed that the unjust were equally happy. Therefore the proof of Book IV must be followed by an account of the unjust soul and an exhibition of its unhappiness. (Foster 1938: 231)

Concerning the overall structure of the Republic and why the latter books are even necessary, although they seemingly don't add much to the theory expoused in Book IV.

Of the three arguments with which the passage opens, the first (576b-580c) proves the supreme happiness (not pleasure) of the just man, and the supreme unhappiness (not pain) of the unjust. (Foster 1938: 231)

Plato is not a Utilitarian.

Skedzielewski, Sean 2020. Justice and the Supposed Fallacy of Irrelevance in Plato's Republic? Polis: The Journal for Ancient Greek and Roman Political Thought 37(2), 317-337. DOI: 10.1163/20512996-12340277

The kinds of actions Glaucon has in mind are all of those actions conventionally thought of as unjust: theft, adultery, murder, prison-escape, and 'all the other things that would make him like a god among humans' (360c1-2). But Socrates, allegedly, responds to Glaucon by praising and defending a narrowly defined and technical-philosophical concept of justice which has little in common with justice as conventionally understood. In this sense Socrates is said to have answered Glaucon's challenge in an irrelevant way. Glaucon wanted to hear conventionally just acts like truth telling praise - so the critique goes - but instead Socrates praises useful falsehood (414b7-c2)! (Skedzielewski 2020: 318)

There is indeed a kind of lacuna between the conventional or vulgar conception of justice (concerning the kinds of actions listed here) and Socrates' grand theory of the harmony of the soul. The ideal does not, as if, come in contact with the real.

One goal of Plato's Republic is to establish a theory that successfully responds to what Reeve calls 'Thrasymacheanism'. Thrasymachus supports the realist definition of justice (διϰαιοσύνη) that justice is the advantage of the stranger. Here, by 'realist' I simply mean that Hrasymacheanism adopts the position that moral claims about justice are true or false, based on whether the specific moral claim is or is not indeed to the advantage of the stronger. Meanwhile, Thrasymachus along with Glaucon and Adeimantus both espouse the nominalist definition that whatever laws the ruling party in a given city wants its subjects to obey will be called 'just' by the rulers. By 'nominalist' I mean that the rulers do not believe that the subjects obeying the laws they offer are actually just; the application of the word 'justice' to such behaviour is a cynical ploy to oppress those who are ignorant of the realist definition of justice as the advantage of the stronger. These two conceptions of justice make it possible for Thrasymachus to assert that the tyrant acts justly by ruling (realist justice) and that the tyrant perpetuates the most extensive acts of injustice (nominal justice). (Skedzielewski 2020: 319)

I'm not a fan of these terms but here they do indeed seem to work. It's a way to conceptualize the thrasymachean trickery of painting injustice as justice - the trope that "rhetoric" is the art of turning black into white at will comes to mind.

The answer that Socrates provides to the question 'What is justice?' apparently must live up to conventional thought or else his interlocutors will be left disappointed that they have not had their challenge met. Whatever answer [|] is given to this question, Socrates' theory of justice (P-justice) seems to need to live up to the widely agreed upon basis of the conventional conception of justice (C-justice) or suffer from irrelevance. (Skedzielewski 2020: 321-322)

The author is following Reeve's manner of naming things, I see. Lets hope this does not get too confusing as it did for me when reading his Philosopher-Kings (Reeve 2006).

For each part to do their own in the city means that the guardians must rule with wisdom, the auxiliaries must defend with civil courage, and the producers must, in moderation, agree to be ruled by their better. Analogously, justice in the soul is the proper governance of its parts by reason, aided by spirit in rendering the appetites compliant and obedient. These images and instances of Justice, as Socrates is well aware, make P-justice in the city and soul unconcerned with 'external' actions, but rather [|] with an internal state of being wherein a proper rulership obtains, producing an 'inner' harmony among the three parts (443c8-e6). Proper psychic rule, then, is distinct from proper conduct. (Skedzielewski 2020: 322-323)

That's the thing for me: it is pretty clear how this 'everyone tending to their own' business works in the city but how exactly the same is supposed in the soul remains a bit vague. Especially when it comes to the question of how, for example, the 'agreement to be ruled' is supposed to work out between the appetitive part and others. Presently I can only see a threat of violence type ordeal, as with the dogs sheparding the sheep, or the lion roaring (perhaps even pawing) the many-headed beast. But this is indeed somewhat off-topic at the moment. In any case the point is very valid: P-justice is about the inner harmony of the soul, C-justice is about external actions.

One apparent answer to Glaucon's challenge is that having proper psychic rule, which is indeed an internal relation, will lead to C-just actions for the soul so organized because such harmony in the soul will prevent the P-just person from committing C-unjust acts. But Socrates has not established this at the close of the argument at the end of Book IV, as Sachs himself notes. (Skedzielewski 2020: 323)

I should really organize my reading notes to have them handy because at the momont I'm blanking where I'm fairly certain - I have a vague recollection - that the P-just person will have no need to commit C-injustices... But as to why, I cannot tell.

In his influential paper, Sachs gives the fallacy of irrelevance its distinctive formulation which is in turn taken up by many other commentators. He thinks that Socrates needs to show two things and that he fails to do either: P-justice will invariably produce C-just actions, and that being truly C-just is sufficient for being P-just. He thinks that this is so because of the nature of Glaucon's challenge. Glaucon's challenge was to have Socrates show that he who commits injustice is less happy than he who always performs just actions. (Skedzielewski 2020: 324)

The footnote clarifies that this is what is meant by "a bi-conditional relationship between P-justice and C-justice". Personally, I would not have thunk it that any amount of C-justice can amount to P-justice. P-justice is a precondution for the harmony of the soul, but C-justice isn't, not necessarily. The problem may be aimed at the very nature of C-justice: what is conventionally just is socially relative.

It has been perceptively suggested that the link between these two unrelated topics - that of mating agreements nad child rearing practices on the one hand and philosopher-kings on the other - is eros. P. Ludwig, 'Eros in the Republic', in G. Ferrari (ed.), The Cambridge Companion to Plato's Republic (New York: Cambridge University Press, 2007), pp. 202-232. Ludwig claims that Socrates introduces eros in a propadeutic way via the sexual arrangements of the Kallipolis, and then, in a more detailed and metaphysically robust way in the metaphor of sun, the divided line, and the allegory of the cave. All of these are, in part, needed to explain the important point that the philosophers are not better off merely because they possess justice, but because possessing justice allows them to possess the greatest goods: the forms, It is eros then - which as appetite, is held in contempt, but as ladder to the intelligible realm, is praised - that leads Socrates into his discussion of the philosopher-kings, and the nature of their rule. (Skedzielewski 2020: 325, fn 18)

Not out of the question. Indeed, it looks like everyone all around is having trouble connecting parts of the Republic to the whole. The connection between eros and appetite is even supported by Aesara and her substitution/original of "love" and "friendship" where Plato has appetite. Sadly, it would be proper to check out Ludwig's paper only after I've read the Symposium.

It turns out that, at least on Socrates' theory, the right-making feature of just actions has been conventionally misunderstood. One can perform all and only C-just actions, but still not be governed by the rational part of the soul, thereby lacking P-justice. P-justice, then, is not unrelated to C-justice, it simply is not related causally, or by sufficiency. Rather conventions about justice should be thought of as blind and grasping attempts at delineation but rising only to the level of belief (πίστις) concerning objects, not to thought (διάνοια) concerning hypotheses (ὑποθέσεις) nor to knowledge (ἐπιστήήμη) concerning forms (εἰδή). (Skedzielewski 2020: 329)

Right to the point.

This altered allegory is intended to show that possessing a harmonious soul and knowing the truth produces P-just rulers competent to govern in the beautiful city only if that truth is something in particular: namely that the intelligible realm is constituted by unchanging, beautiful forms, ultimately illuminated by the form of the Good; that the intelligible realm does indeed contain objects worth imitating, and propagating in one's own city, thereby giving the P-just philosopher king good reason to bring Justice itself (not C-justice, as Sachs and Irwin would have it) into being as much as possible in the sensible realm. (Skedzielewski 2020: 330)

That's the rub: Sachs is trying to overcome the gap between P-justice and C-justice on, what amounts to, textual basis: the argument of the Republic for him requires that P satisfy C, whereas the actual point is, in my opinion, that C-justice is pretty much worthless; by analogy it's like trying to make gold look like iron or bronze. Why even?

The difference between the C-unjust acts of the philosopher-kings and the C-unjust acts of tyrants is that the former perform such acts with the fulfillment of their rational desires in mind, and the desire to bring the people and city around them into a condition more closely approximating Justice itself; whereas tyrants perform such acts in an attempt to satisfy their warped and perverted appetitive desires. (Skedzielewski 2020: 332)

Here's where I take issue with "reevesianism": I'm not satisfied that the philosopher-king/queen has only necessary rational desires. I see, as of yet, no reason why they cannot have unnecessary rational desires. Call them, idk, thesic affections, if you will. The philosopher is not infallible.

The chimera - human, lion, and the beastly hydra identified with the rational, spirited, and appetitive parts respectively - serves (at least) three functions: it 1) makes the explanatory link between P-justice and C-justice clear through the conspicuous nature of the analogy; 2) persuades rhetorically by identifying the rational part with the properly human; and 3) lays the groundwork for the startling (though tentative) disavowal of the tripartite soul foud in the Glaucus analogy. (Skedzielewski 2020: 332)

Hydra - ooh, that's good. It implies that the appetitive part is, in a way, snakish. That is to say... reptilian. That the rational part is human-figured is purely rhetorical I also do not buy. It is supposed to be the most god-like part, 'made in his image' yada-yada.

Then let us persuade him gently - for he isn't wrong of his own will - by asking him these questions. Should we say that this [P-justice] is the original basis for the conventions about what is fine and what is shameful [C-justice]? Fine things are those that subordinate the beastlike parts of our nature to the human - or better, perhaps, to the divine; shameful ones are those that enslave the gentle to the savage? (589c4-d2)
And don't you think that licentiousness has long been condemned [by convention] for just these reasons, namely, that because of it, that terrible large, and multiform beast is let loose more than it should be [P-injustice]? (590a4-6)
And aren't stubbornness and irritability condemned [by convention] because they inharmoniously increase and stretch the lionlike and snakelike part [states of soul]? (590a7-b1)
And aren't luxury and softness condemned [by convention] because the slackening and loosening of this same part produce cowardice in it [P-injustice]? (590b3-4)
Socrates is constantly emphasizing the distinction between what everyone believes, and the justification for those conventional beliefs, in order to show that popular morality itself - implicitly and without awareness - sees the origin of injustice in states of the soul, not in deeds or agreed upon rules of conduct. (Skedzielewski 2020: 333)

Oh damn, even Reeve had "snakelike element" (590a) that I completely missed in favour of the more appealing "moblike" (590b).

The P-justice hypothesis provides an answer to the meta-ethical question, 'what makes an action good?'. Socrates answers that it is the impact an action has on the soul which makes the action good or bad. The confusion in the literature comes from misunderstanding the normative component of the theory. Sachs and others expect that the normative component of P-justice needs to prescribe C-just acts. But this is mistaken. The hypothesis of justice as psychic harmony prescribes P-just acts, i.e. acts that produce the proper condition in the soul. Socrates' theory is related to conventional beliefs about morality in an explanatory, meta-ethical way, but not in a normative way. (Skedzielewski 2020: 334)

If I refuse to return a borrowed firearm to a drunken friend whose girlfriend has just cheated on him and he found out, and I know where she's hiding from him and he doesn't... My soul is free from truly lying and stealing when I say that I "don't know" where she might be and "forgot" where I placed his gun.

No man should idnetify with the hydra, he implies, for that would be to choose the part that is not fully human, that is beastly and brutish, blindly craving both what is good and bad for itself; to so misidentify oneself with the beast is to be enslaved by something that ought to naturally be a slave itself, a theme echoed in the degeneration story from democracy into tyranny. (Skedzielewski 2020: 334)

Reign in your reptilian brain.

A Luminous Pyramid

Taylor, Thomas 1804. General Introduction to the Philosophy and Writings of Plato. In: The Works of Plato, viz. his fifty-five dialogues, and twelve epistles, translated from the Greek; nine of the dialogues by the late Ployer Sydenham, and the remainder by Thomas Taylor: With occasional annotations on the nine dialogues translated by Sydenham, and copious notes, by the latter translator; in which is given the substance of nearly all the existing Greek MS. commentaries on the philosophy of Plato, and a considerable portion of such as are already published. In five volumes. Vol. 1. London: Thomas Taylor, iii-cxv. [Internet Archive]

"Philosophy," says Hierocles, "is the purification and perfection of human life. It is the purification, indeed, from material irrationality, and the mortal body; but the perfection, in consequence of being the resumption of our proper felicity, and a reascent to the divine likeness. To effect these two is the province of Virtue and Truth; the former exterminating the immoderation of the passions; and the latter introducing the divine form to those who are naturally adapted to its reception." (Taylor 1804: iii)

Taylor's translation of Iamblichus was my first introduction to ancient philosophy, so this feels like circling back. "Felicity" is his equivalent for happiness. Material irrationality vs divine form.

Of philosophy thus defined, which may be compared to a luminous pyramid, terminating in Deity, and having for its basis the rational soul of man and its spontaneous unperverted conceptions, - of this philosophy, august, magnificent, and divine, Plato may be justly called the primary leader and hierophant, through whom, like the mystic light in the inmost recesses of some sacred temple, it first shone forth with occult and venerable splendor. (Taylor 1804: iii)

Already got a title for the post.

Hence it is easy to collect [|] its preeminence to all other philosophies; to show that where they oppose it they are erroneous; that so far as they contain any thing scientific they are allied to it; and that at best they are but rivulets from this vast ocean of thruth. (Taylor 1804: iii-iv)

Taylor clearly does not distinguish religion from philosophy. The cart is before the horse, as depicted in this here image of other philosophy-rivers flowing from the ocean of Plato's philosophy: water flowing uphill, defying gravity.

Of all the dogmas of Plato, that concerning the first principle of things as far transcends in sublimity the doctrine of other philosophers of a different sect, on this subject, as this supreme cause of all transcends other causes. For, according to Plato, the highest God, whom in the Republic he calls the good, and in the Parmenides the one, is not only above soul and intellect, but is even superior to being itself. Hence, since every thing which can in any respect be known, or of which any thing can be asserted, must be connected with the universality of things, but the first cause is above all things, it is very properly said by Plato to be perfectly ineffable. (Taylor 1804: v)

Hen.

Let us then consider body, (that is, a triply extended substance,) endued with quality; for this is the first thing effable by us, and is sensible. (Taylor 1804: vii)

A point is extended to a line; a line is extended to a surface; and a surface is extended to a body.

For elements are always indigent of each other, and that which is composed from elements is indigent of the elements. In short, this sensible nature, and which is so manifest to us, is neither body; for this does not of itself move the senses, nor quality; for this does not possess an interval commensurate with sense. Hence, that which is the object of sight, is neither body nor colour; but coloured body, or colour corporalized, is that which is motive of the sight. And universally that which is sensible, which is body with a particular quality, is motive of sense. From hence, it is evident that the thing which excites the sense is something incorporeal. For if it was body, it would not yet be the object of sense. Body therefore requres that which is incorporeal, and that which is incorporeal, body. (Taylor 1804: viii)

Really mushy philosophy. We don't see bodies, we see the colors of bodies. When we see a piece of cheese in front of us on the table, what we're really seeing is the colour of cheese. Therefore cheese is something incorporeal.

Let it then be supposed to be that which is called nature, being a principle of motion and rest, in that which is moved and at rest, essentially and not according to accident. For this is something more simple, and is fabricative of composite forms. If, however, it is in the things fabricated, and does not subsist separate from, nor prior to them, but stands in need of them for its being, it will not be unindigent; though it possesses something transcendent with respect to them, viz. the power of fashioning nad fabricating them. (Taylor 1804: ix)

Absolutely incomprehensible.

By the like arguments we may show that the principle cannot be irrational soul, whether sensitive, or orectic. For if it appears that it has something separate, together with impulsive and gnostic energies, yet at the same time, it is bound in body, and has something inseparable from it; since it is not able to convert itself to itself, but its energy is mingled with its subject. (Taylor 1804: x)

Define:orectic - "of or concerning desire or appetite."

But the impulses of other irrational animals are uniform and spontaneous, are moved together with the sensible organs, and require the senses alone that they may obtain from sensibles the pleasurable, and avoid the painful. (Taylor 1804: x)

All birdsong is the same sequence of notes called Pachelbel's Canon.

Besides the one here is indigent of the many, because it has its subsistence in the many. Or it may be said, that this one is collective of the many, and this not by itself, but in conjunction with them. (Taylor 1804: xii)

Totality is the unity of plurality type stuff.

Hence there is much of the indigent in this principle. For since intellect generates in itself its proper plenitudes from which the whole at once receives its completion, it will be itself indigent of itself, not only that which si generated of that which generates, but also that which generates of that which is generated, in order to the whole completion of that which wholly generates itself. (Taylor 1804: xii)

Go generate yourself.

It has therefore, if it be lawful so to speak, an ultimate vestige of indigence, just as on the contrary matter has an ultimate echo of the unindigent, or a most obscure and debile impression of the one. (Taylor 1804: xv)

Define:debile - "feeble"; "having no strength, muscle, or power"; "botany. having no ability to bear or hold up flowers or leaves." Huh.

And indeed the soul which moves the body, must be considered as a more proper self-moved essence. This, however, is two-fold, the one rational, the other irrational. For that there is a rational soul is evident: or has not every one a consensation of himself, more clear or more obscure, when converted to himself in the attentions to and investigations of himself, and in the vital and gnostic animadversions of himself? For the essence which is capable of this, and which can collect universals by reasonnig, will very justly be rational. The irrational soul also, though it does not appear to investigate these things, and to reason with itself, yet at the same time it moves bodies from place to place, being itself previously moved from itself; for at different times it exerts a different impulse. (Taylor 1804: xvii)

Self-perception meets motivity. The ending quite naturally resembles Reggie Watts' "You can move objects from one area to another. You can feel your body. You can say, "I'd like to go over to this location," and you can move this mass of molecules through the air over to another location, at will."

But it would be absurd to say that the energies of every irrational soul are not the energies of that soul, but of one more divine; since they are infinite, and mingled with much of the base and imperfect. For this would be just the same as to say that the irrational energies are the energies of the rational soul. (Taylor 1804: xviii)

Thereby exploding Charles Fourier's theory that human passions are also god's creation. For how could the perfect being who created the ever-expanding universe, create something that is many.

Nor does irrational appetite desire itself, but aspires after a certain object of desire, such as honour, or pleasure, or riches. (Taylor 1804: xviii)

Oddly enough: (0) pleasure; (1) riches; (2) honour. Discovering (3) truth is supposed to be the highest pleasure, and gaining riches and honour merely lower pleasures, while food, drink and sex provide the lowest pleasures.

[...] for it appears in a certain respect to subsist by itself, separate from a subject; so that it becomes doubtful whether it is self-motive, or alter-motive. (Taylor 1804: xix)

Auto- and allo-motivity.

But let there be the united and the unical, and, if you will, the two principles bound and the infinite. Plato, however, never in any respect makes a negation of the one which is beyond all these. (Taylor 1804: xxii)

According to Urban Dictionary, a unical is "A man without testicles".

And in short, so far as it is admitted [|] to be one, so far it will be coarranged with other things which are the subject of position. (Taylor 1804: xxii-xxiii)

Kooskorrastus (vt Durant 1936: 6).

Thus too, whatever possesses symmetry, and whatever is true, and all principles, are in a certain respect connate with the first principle, so far as they are principles and fountains and goodnesses, with an appropriate subjection and analogy. (Taylor 1804: xxv)

Define:connate - "(especially of ideas or principles) existing in a person or thing from birth; innate."

As the monad and the centre of a circle are images from their simplicity of this greatest of principles, so likewise do they perspicuously shadow forth to us its causal comprehension of all things. For all number may be considered as subsisting occultly in the monad, and the circle in the centre; this occult being the same in each with causal subsistence. (Taylor 1804: xxvii)

"Occultly" (neo)pythagorean.

Hence, since the soul imparts life and motion to other things, on which account Aristotle calls an animal αυτοϰινητον, self-moved. it will much more, and by a much greater priority, impart life and motion to itself. (Taylor 1804: xxxi)

Loom on iseliikur.

But as this is by no means the case, it principally derives its immediate subsistence from a deity of a fabricative characteristic, whom Plato calls Jupiter, conformably to the theology of Orpheus. (Taylor 1804: xxxi)

Not sure what this is about. Jupiter is the Roman equivalent of Zeul and there's nothing in eithers Wikipedia article about them being creator-gods.

Lastly, from all that has been said, it must, I think, be immediately obvious to every one whose mental eye is not entirely blinded, that there can be no such thing as a trinity in the theology of Plato, in any respect analogous to the Christian Trinity. For the highest God, according to Plato, as we have largely shown from riresistible evidence, is so far from being a part of a consubsistent triad, that he is not to be connumerated with any thing; but is so perfectly exempt from all multitude, that he is even beyond being; and he so ineffably transcends all relation and habitude, that language is in reality subverted about him, and knowledge refunded into ignorance. (Taylor 1804: xxxv)

No doubt partly why Christian theologists denounce Plato's thought as incompatible with Christianity and the stuff that various church councils have revealed as religion.

"But those," says Proclus, "who treats of divine concerns in an indicative manner, either speak symbolically and fabulously, or through images. And of those who openly announce their conceptions, some frame their discourses according to science, but others according to inspiration from the gods. And he who desires to signify divine concerns through symbols is Orphic, and, in short, accords with those who write fables respecting the gods. But he who does this through images is Pythagoric. For the mathematical disciplines were invented by the Pythagoreans, in order to a reminiscence of divine concerns, to which, through these as images, they endeavour to ascend. For they refer both numbers and figures to the gods, according to the testimony of their historians." (Taylor 1804: xxxvii)

What sorts of "images" did the Pythagoreans use?

Since, however, we possess intellect, opinion, and phantasy, demonstrations are given with a view to intellect: and hence Plato says, that if you are willing to energize according to intellect, you will have demonstrations bound with adamantine chains; if according to opinion, you will have the testimony of renowned persons; and if according to the phantasy, you have fables by which it is excited; so that from all these you will derive advantage. (Taylor 1804: xli)

Finally something helpful for my undertaking: this connects "opinion" with the honour-lover psychological type. And naturally so, because honour, renown and opinion are related: "honour" is a type of opinion (the same person some consider honourable, others not). It's a more sensible connection between the parts of the soul and the divided line than e.g. Reeve's, according to which "The intellectual resources of a money-lover amount to no more than opinion" (p. 98), and the strained justification of why honour-lovers should be limited to figures or "scientific-thought" because of frustrated pleasures or something (p. 248).

"It is necessary, however, to evince, that each of the dogmas accords with Platonic principles, and the mystic traditions of theologists. For all the Grecian theology is the progeny of the mystic doctrine of Orpheus; Pythagoras first of all learning from Aglaophemus the orgies of the gods, but Plato in the second place receiving an all-perfect science [|] of the divinities from the Pythagoric and Orphic writings. For in the Philebus, referring the theory about the two forms of principles (bound and infinity) to the Pythagoreans, he calls them men dwelling with the gods, and truly blessed. Philolaus, therefore, the Pythagorean, has left us in writing many admirable conceptions about these principles, celebrating their common progression into beings, and their separate fabrication. Again, in the Timæus, endeavouring to teach us about the sublunary gods and their order, Plato flies to theologists, calls them the sons of the gods, and makes them the fathers of the truth about these divinities." (Taylor 1804: xliii-xliv)

Taylor is once again quoting Proclus on the connection with Pythagoreanism.

The next important Platonic dogma in order, is that concerning ideas, about which the reader will find so much said in the notes on the Parmenides, that but little remains to be added here. That little however is as follows: The divine Pythagoras, and all those who have legitimately received his doctrines, among whom Plato holds the most distinguished rank, asserted that there are many orders of beings, viz. intelligible, intellectual, dianoëtic, physical, or, in short, vital and corporeal essences. For the progression of things, the subjection which naturally subsists together with such progression, and the power of diversity in coordinate genera, give subsistence to all the multitude of corporeal and incorporeal natures. They said, therefore, that there are three orders in the whole extent of beings, viz. the intelligible, the dianoëtic, and the sensible; and that in each of these ideas subsist, characterized by the respective essential properties of the natures by which they are contained. And with respect to intelligible ideas, these they placed among [|] divine natures, together with the producing, paradigmatic, and final causes of things in a consequent order. For if these three causes sometimes concur, and are united among themselves (which Aristotle says is the case), without doubt this will not happen in the lowest works of nature, but in the first and most excellent causes of things, which on account of their exuberant fecundity have a power generative of all things, and from their converting and rendering similar to themselves the natures which they have generated, are the paradigms or exemplars of all things. But as these divine causes act for their own sake, and on account of their own goodness, do they not exhibit the final cause? Since therefore intelligible forms are of this kind, and are the leaders of so much good to wholes, they give completion to the divine orders, though they largely subsist about the intelligible order contained in the artificer of the universe. But dianoëtic forms or ideas imitate the intellectual, which have a prior subsistence, render the order of soul similar to the intellectual order, and comprehend all things in a secondary degree. (Taylor 1804: xlix-l)

Somewhat difficult. There are those (e.g. Chase and Clay) who argue that Plato got his doctrine of ideas from the pythagoreans. That the pythagoreans distinguished between rational and irrational (e.g. intelligible and sensible) is got from Aristotle's Metaphysics. And then there are those who claim that they were the first to deal with the theory of definition, i.e. organizing things into genus and species. Sadly, the second part of this passage is incomprehensible to me - what are the three causes? What even is this.

In the Timaæus, he manifestly asserts that the demiurgusu implanted these dianoëtic forms in souls, in geometric, arithmetic, and harmonic proportions: but in his Republic (in the section of a line in the 6th book) he calls them images of intelligibles; and on this account does not for the most part disdain to denominate them intellectual, as being the exemplars of sensible natures. (Taylor 1804: l)

Something, something, Gorgias 508a.

In what manner then, says Syrianus, do ideas subsist according to the contemplative lovers of truth? We reply, intelligibly and tetradically (νοητως ϰαι τετραδιϰως), in animal itself (εν τῳ αυτοζωῳ), or the extremity of the [|] intelligible order; but intellectually and decadically (νοερως ϰαι δεϰαδιϰως), in the intellect of the artificer of the universe: for, according to the Pythagoric Hymn, "Divine number proceeds from the retreats of the undecaying monad, till it arrives at the divine tetrad which produced the mother of all things, the universal recipient, neverable, circularly investigating all things with bound, immovable and unwearied, and which is denominated the sacred decad, both by the immortal gods and earth-born men." (Taylor 1804: lii-liii)

Golden Verses 46-51.

As the world too, considered as one great comprehending whole, is called by Plato a divine animal, so likewise every whole which it [|] contains is a world, possessing, in the first place, a self-perfect unity; proceeding from the ineffable, by which it becomes a god; in the second place, a divine intellect; in the third place, a divine soul; and in the last place, a deified body. (Taylor 1804: lv-lvi)

The world-soul graded according to the divided line.

In answer to such like cant, for it is nothing more, - a cant produced by the most profound ignorance, and frequently attended with the most deplorable envy, I ask, is then the Delphic precept, KNOW THYSELF, a trivial mandate? Can this be accomplished by every man? Or can any one properly know himself without knowing the rank he holds in the scale of being? And can this be effected without knowing what are the natures which he surpasses, and what those are by which he is surpassed? And can he know this without knowing as much of those natures as it is possible for him to know? (Taylor 1804: lviii)

The answer to "Who am I?" is for the neoplatonist the same as to "Who am I in comparison with Santa Claus and the tooth fairy?"

After this follows the irrational nature, the summit of which is the phantasy, or that power which perceives every thing accompanied with figure and interval; and on this account it may be called a figured intelligence (μορϕωτιϰη νοησις). This power, as Jamblichus beautifully observes, grows upon, as it were, and fashions all the powers of the soul; exciting in opinion the illuminations from the senses, and fixing in that life which is extended with body, the impressions which descend from intellect. Hence, says Proclus, it folds itself about the indivisibility of true intellect, conforms itself to all formless species, and becomes perfectly every thing, from which the dianoëtic power, and our indivisible reason consists. Hence too, it is all things passively which intellect is impassively, and on this account Aristotle calls it passive intellect. Under this subsist anger and desire, the former resembling a raging lion, and the latter a many-headed beast; and the whole is bounded by sense, which is nothing more than a passive perception of things, and on this account is justly said by PLato to be rather passion than knowledge; since the former of these is characterized by inertness, and the latter by energy. (Taylor 1804: lxi)

If I'm reading this correctly, then Taylor divides both rational and irrational parts of the soul into triads. The preceding pages dealt with the rational part and did not make enough sense for me to elucidate how exactly the "theoretic", "intellect in capacity" and dianoia are interrelated. Here, the irrational part is at least clearly ordered: (3) the phantasy, which is yet a kind of intelligence - of figures - and communicates with the rational parts; (2) the angry lion; (1) the desiring beast; and all of them are as-if encapsulated in (0) sense-perception.

But it contains intelligibles after the manner of an image, and receives partibly their impartible forms, such as are uniform variously, and such as are immovable, according to a self-motive condition. (Taylor 1804: lxii)

Plotinian nonsense.

For the essence of man subsisting as a medium between dæmoniacal natures, who always have an intellectual knowledge of divinity, and those beings who are never adapted by nature to understand him, it ascends to the former and descends to the latter, through the possession and desertion of intellect. For it becomes familiar both with the divine and brutal likeness, through the amphibious condition of its nature. (Taylor 1804: lxvi)

Demons - they know god.

The medium, therefore, must be that whose essence is eternal, but energy temporal. And the three orders which compose this frist middle and last are, the intellectual, psychical (or that pertaining to soul), and corporeal. For from what has been already said by us concerning the gradation of beings, it is evident that the intellectual order is established in eternity, both in essence and energy; that the corporeal order is always in generation, or advancing to being, and this either in an infinite time, or in a part of time; and that the psychical is indeed eternal in essence, but temporal in energy. (Taylor 1804: lxxiii)

Mind, body, and soul - now distinguished in terms of essence and energy.

Hence Plato, looking to this, says in the Timæus, that the world is mingled from intellect and necessity, the former ruling over the latter. For by necessity here he means the motive cause of bodies, which in other places he calls Fate. (Taylor 1804: lxxiv)

Necessity is the motive cause of bodies?

For if these sciences receive the soul replete with images, and knowing nothing subtile, and unattended with material garrulity; and if they elucidate reasons possessing an irrefragable necessity of demonstration, [|] and forms full of all certainty and immateriality, and which by no means call to their aid the inaccuracy of sensibles, do they not evidently purify our intellectual life from things which fill us with a privation of intellect, and which impede our perception of true being? (Taylor 1804: lxxvi-lxxvii)

Define:irrefragable - "not able to be refuted or disproved; indisputable."

To such as these, who have gazed on the dark and deformed face of their nurse, till they are incapable of beholding the light of truth, and who are become so drowsy from drinking immoderately of the cup of oblivion, that their whole life is nothing more than a transmigration from sleep to sleep, and from dream to dream, like men passing from one bed to another, - to such as these, the road through which we have been travelling will appear to be a delusive passage, and the objects which we have surveyed to be nothing more than phantastic visions, seen only by the eye of imagination, and when seen, idle and vain as the dreams of a shadow. (Taylor 1804: lxxix)

"The psyche lives through a cycle of deaths and rebirths, and each rebirth is preceded by an amnesia-inducing drink of the waters of Oblivion." (Reeve 2006: 108) - From my own reading of the Republic, I concluded with the distinct impression that Plato is effectively telling you not to drink from that river but to pass through it to the other side - throat parched but memories intact. Here Taylor is using it as a figure imo too willy-nilly, as if it made a difference whether you drank a little or a lot: you'll forget your journey nevertheless; he's implying that it is the amount of drink during your stay in the fields of Lethe that has an effect on whether your next life-cycle you'll metaphorically look up or down. This seems like a very suspect addition.

The following arguments, however, may perhaps awaken some few of those who are less lethargic than the rest, from the sleep of sense, and enable them to elevate their mental eye from the dark mire in which they are plunged, and gain a glimpse of this most weighty truth, that there is another world, of which this is nothing more than a most [|] obscure resemblance, and another life, of which this is but the flying mockery. (Taylor 1804: lxxix-lxxx)

"Lethargy comes from the Greek lethargos, originally meaning "inactive through forgetfulness.""

Thus, to mention a few from among a countless multitude. In the catalogue of those endued [|] with sovereign power, it had for its votaries Dion the Siracusian, Julian the Roman, and Chosroes the Persian, emperor; among the leaders of armies, it had Chabrias and Phocion, those brave generals of the Athenians; among mathematicians, those leading stars of science, Eudoxus, Archimedes and Euclid; among biographers, the inimitable Plutarch; among physicians, the admirable Galen; among critics, that prince of philologists, Longinus; and among poets, the most learned and majestic Virgil. (Taylor 1804: lxxxiv-lxxxv)

A rundown of famous ancient platonists.

In our own country, however, though no one appears to have wholly devoted himself to the study of this philosophy, and he who does not will never penetrate its depths, yet we have a few bright examples of no common proficiency in its more accessible parts. The instances I allude to are Shaftesbury, Akenside, Harris, Petwin, and Sydenham. So splendid is the specimen of philosophic abilities displayed by these writers, like the fair dawning of some unclouded morning, that we have only deeply to regret that the sun of their genius sat, before we were gladdened with its effluence. (Taylor 1804: lxxxvi)

Only Shaftesbury rings familiar. Maybe: Mark Akenside (1721-1770), James Harris (1709-1780), Thomas Sydenham (1624-1689). Who this "Petwin" could have been, not even ChatGPT can say.

We have said that this philosophy at first shone through Plato with an occult and venerable splendour; and it is owing to the hidden manner in which it is delivered by him, that its depth was not fathomed till many ages after its promulgation, and when fathomed, was treated by superficial readers with ridicule and contempt. Plato indeed is not singular in delivering his philosophy occultly: for this was the custom of all the great antients; a custom not originating from a wish [|] to become tyrant in knowledge, and keep the multitude in ignorance, but from a profound conviction that the sublimest truths are profaned when clearly unfolded to the vulgar. This indeed must necessarily follow; since, as Socrates in Plato justly observes, "it is not lawful for the pure to be touched by the impure;" and the multitude are neither purified from the defilements of vice, nor the darkness of two-fold ignorance. Hence, while they are thus doubly impure, it is as impossible for them to perceive the splendours of truth, as for an eye buried in mire to survey the light of day. (Taylor 1804: lxxxvi-lxxxvii)

Concerning how both Pythagoras and Plato "grudged to communicate to others, the knowledge of sublime and valuable truths" (Spens 1763: xxv). Taylor's justification of it comes across as It's not that Plato was some sort of intellectual tyrant; it's just that he thought that the bulk of humanity is dirty trash unworthy of his sublime truths.

This task was reserved for men who were born indeed in a baser age, but who being allotted a nature similar to their leader, were the true interpreters of his mystic speculations. The most conspicuous of these are, the great Plotinus, the most learned Porhyry, the divine Jamblichus, the most acute Syrianus, Proclus the consummation of philosophic excellence, the magnificent Hierocles, the concisely elegant Sallust, and the most inquisitive Damascius. By these men, who were truly links of the golden [|] chait of deity, all that is sublime, all that is mystic in the doctrines of PLato (and they are replete with both these in a transcendent degree), was freed from its obscurity and unfolded into the most pleasing and admirable light. Their labours, however, have been ungratefully received. The beautiful light which they benevolently disclosed has hithero unnoticed illumined philosophy in her desolate retreats, like a lamp shining on some venerable statue amidst dark and solitary ruins. (Taylor 1804: lxxxvii-lxxxviii)

A rundown of the neoplatonists. And indeed it appears that most of history has regarded them with scorn, and only recent centuries have welcomed them with opened arms.

It would seem that those intemperate critics who have thought proper to revile Plotinus, the leader of the latter Platonists, have paid no attention to the testimony of Longinus concerning this most wonderful man, as preserved by Porphyry in his life of him. For Longinus there says, "that though he does not entirely accede to many of his hypotheses, yet he exceedingly admires and loves the form of his writing, the density of his conceptions, and the philosophic manner in which his questions are disposed." And in another place he says, "Plotinus, as it seems, has explained the Pythagoric and Platonic principles more clearly than those that were prior to him; for neither are the writings of Numenius, Cronius, Moderatus, and Thrasyllus, to be compared for accuracy with those of Plotinus on this subject." (Taylor 1804: lxxxix, fn 1)

Dammit.

In the next place, they had books to consult, written by the immediate disciplines of Plato, which have been lost for upwards of a thousand years, besides many Pythagoric writings from which Plato himself derived most of his more sublime dogmas. Hence [|] we find the works of Parmenides, Empedocles, the Eleatic Zeno, Speusippus, Xenocrates, and many other illustrious philosophers of the highest antiquity, who were either genuine Platonists, or the sources of the Platonism, are continually cited by these most excellent interpreters. (Taylor 1804: xci-xcii)

The early neoplatonists had the advantage of by now extinct literature.

It is necessary to observe, that in those dialogues, in which Socrates is indeed introduced, but sustains an inferior part, he is presented to our view as a learner, and not as a teacher; and this is the case in the Parmenides and Timæus. For by the former of these philosophers he is instructed in the most abstruse theological dogmas, and by the latter in the whole of physiology. (Taylor 1804: xcviii, fn 1)

Parmenides teaches physiology (i.e. physics or ontology), and Timaeus gives instruction in the most abstruse theological dogmas. The latter description is so well put.

Hence I have placed those dialogues first which ranks as wholes, or have the relation of a system, and afterwards those in which these systems are branched out into particulars. Thus, after the First Alcibiades, [|] which may be called, and appears to have been generally considered by the antients, an introduction to the whole of Plato's philosophy, I have placed the Republic and the Laws, which may be said to comprehend systematically the morals and politics of Plato. After these I have ranked the Timæus, which contains the whole of his physiology, and together with it the Critias, because of its connection with the Timæus. The next in order is the Parmenides, which contains a system of his theology. Thus far this arrangement is conformable to the natural progress of the human mind in the acquisition of the sublimest knowledge: the subsequent arrangement principally regards the order of things. After the Parmenides then, the Sophista, Phædrus, Greater Hippias, and Banquet, follow, which may be considered as so many lesser wholes subordinate to and comprehended in the Parmenides, which, like the universe itself, is a whole of wholes. For in the Sophista being itself is investigated, in the Banquet love itself, and in the Phædrus beauty itself; all which are intelligible forms, and are consequently contained in the Parmenides, in which the whole extent of the intelligible is unfolded. The Greater Hippias is classed with the Phædrus, because in the latter the whole series of the beautiful is discussed, and in the former that which subsists in soul. After these follows the Theætetus, in which science considered as subsisting in soul is investigated; science itself, according to its first subsistence, having been previously celebrated by Socrates in one part of the Phædrus. The Politicus and Minos, which follow next, may be considered as ramifications from the Laws: and, in short, all the following dialogues either consider more particularly the dogmas which are systematically comprehended in those already enumerated, or naturally flow from them as their original source. As it did not however appear possible to arrange these dialogues which rank as parts in the same accurate order as those [|] which we considered as wholes, it was thought better to class them either according to their agreement in one particular circumstance, as the Phædo, Apology, and Crito, all which relate to the death of Socrates, and as the Meno and Protagoras, which relate to the question whether virtue can be taught; or according to their agreement in character, as the Lesser Hippias and Euthydemus, which are anatreptic, and the Theages, Laches, and Lysis, which are maieutic dialogues. The Cratylus is ranked in the last place, not so much because the subject of it is etymology, as because a great part of it is deeply theological [...] (Taylor 1804: ciii-cv)

The totality. Taylor proceeds with from wholes to parts but also has theological considerations in mind. Personally, I would have picked up Cratylus up next because it deals with language and thus could be viewed semiotically.

As I profess to give the reader a translation of the genuine works of Plato only, I have not translated the Axiochus, Demodocus, Sisyphus, &c. as these are evidently spurious dialogues. (Taylor 1804: cv, fn 1)

Hmm. I wonder if these have been translated by now.

Of the translation of the Republic by Dr. Spens, it is necessary to observe, that a considerable part of it is very faithfully executed; but that in the more abstruse parts it is inaccurate; and that it every where abounds with Scotticisms which offend an English ear, and vulgarisms which are no less disgraceful to the translator than disgusting to the reader. Suffice it therefore to say of this version, that I have adopted it wherever I found it could with propriety be adopted, and given my own translation where it was otherwise. (Taylor 1804: cvii)

I did notice that the first few pages were almost identical. I'll take this as an indication that Spens's translation might actually deserve a reading - exactly because of the Scotticisms and vulgarisms.

To such as are destitute of these requisites, who make the study of words their sole employment, and the pursuit of wisdom but at best a secondary thing, who expected to be wise by desultory application for an hour or two in a day, after the fatigues of business, after mixing with the base multitude of mankind, laughing with the gay, affecting airs of gravity with the serious, tacitly assenting to every man's opinion, however absurd, and winking at folly however shameful and base - to such as these - and, alas! the world is full of such - the sublimest truths must appear to be nothing more than [|] jargon and reverie, the dreams of a distempered imagination, or the ebullitions of fanatical faith. (Taylor 1804: cxii-cxiii)

The base multitude of mankind. Jeebus.

It is well said indeed by Lysis, the Pythagorean, that to inculcate liberal speculations and discourses to those whose morals are turbid and confused, is just as absurd as to your pure and transparent water into a deep well full of mire and clay; for he who does this will only disturb the mud, and cause the pure water to become defiled. (Taylor 1804: cxiii)

One takes water out of a well. Why should someone pour water into a well?

Let not such then presume to explore the regions of Platonic philosophy. The land is too pure to admit the sordid and the base. The road which conducts to it is too intricate to be discovered by the unskilful and stupid, and the journey is too long and laborious to be accomplished by the effeminate and the timid, by the slave of passion and the dupe of opinion, by the lover of sense and the despiser of truth. (Taylor 1804: cxiv)

Gatekeeping some of the oldest philosophy we have because it contains some theology.